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LUCIFER: Rachael Harris and Tom Ellis on Linda’s Future Reaction to Angels and Demons
Dr. Linda Martin now knows the truth on LUCIFER. The Psychiatrists who thought her patient had been speaking in metaphors nows that the Devil and angels and demons are very real. Her initial reaction was one of shock. When Maze approached her, Linda questioned how they could be friends. But the good doctor seems to be gradually making peace with the idea that these celestial — and devilish — creatures are real.
During a visit to the set of LUCIFER in Vancouver*, Rachael Harris (Dr. Linda Martin) and Tom Ellis (Lucifer) spoke about what’s next for Linda and Lucifer now that she knows his secret. Hint: she’s actually kind of excited.
What’s Next? “What’s great is [Linda is] no longer rolling her eyes at [Lucifer] and looking at him as an object,” Harris explains. “She’s actually seeing him even though it’s completely foreign to her. When you finally hear the truth from somebody, you relax and you don’t feel like you have to manipulate. I feel their relationship gets deeper and it’s better because she feels like she can actually help him. They do get to a place where he says, ‘Look at me. I’m just a person with a very dysfunctional family.’ They get to a point where she goes, if I can look at you in this category, and he’s like, just treat me like a normal patient. She really does struggle with that….I did have a question of, ‘Is there going to be anything interesting for them to talk about?’ In actuality, now it’s even better, because she can really, really get into it with him.”
Going All In. Linda’s curiosity about things that she believed were only stories is definitely going to grow, Harris said. “In the pilot, Lucifer says [Maze] is a complicated one. She does start getting off on [this knowledge]. She starts asking him a lot of questions. [She points out,] ‘I’m the only one who knows this.’ She does get off on it and that’s what’s great: she uses her education to then ask more questions. Her whole thing is learning what makes people take. Now she’s like, now I get to learn what makes the celestial beings tick….And to Maze, she sees the humanity in Maze. She sees a growth in Maze that is really exciting.” Fans should also expect to see more from Linda and Maze as their relationship continues to deepen.
Is Lucifer Regretting His Choice? From a purely selfish standpoint, the devil doesn’t think he made the right choice according to Ellis. Mostly because Linda is too busy talking about celestial topics instead of Lucifer’s issues: “It’s kind of [like] Lucifer didn’t think this thing through. It becomes almost inconvenient for him that his therapist now wants to talk about other things other than him. So, you know, that all aside, he still wants to go to therapy and find out what’s going on with everything and her sort of going off on her own thing is very, very sort of annoying for Lucifer. It’s something that, again, he didn’t think it through. He didn’t think it through at all. So what comes with it is inconvenient and then we make a progression, but you can’t make that much progression when someone knows you’re the actual devil.”
For more on what’s next on LUCIFER, read our post-mortem cast interviews about the events of the most recent episode. And don’t miss an all new episode of LUCIFER on November 14 at 9:00 p.m. ET/PT on Fox (U.S.) and CTV (Canada).
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THE FALL Roundtable: Three Thoughts Before Season 3 Comes to Netflix
THE FALL season 3 is set to premiere on Netflix on October 29. While viewers on the other side of the globe have watched the finale on BBC Two, quite a lot of us have been anxiously awaiting the latest run of episodes. Before the Netflix debut gives fans — whether of Gillian Anderson, Jamie Dornan, or just the series in general — a chance to binge, I took some time out to chat about the series with some fellow writers. We touched on some of our favorite things about THE FALL, what we might like to see done differently, and (of course) where we’d like to see it all go. What better way to prepare for new episodes than to have a good conversation with friends, right? Check out our roundtable for THE FALL, and make sure to enjoy season 3 — unless, of course, you’ve already had the opportunity to watch on television.
What have been some of the strongest aspects of the series for you?
Shana Lieberman: I think, for me, the keyword that would best describe every single positive aspect of THE FALL is “unapologetic.” The series is unapologetically dark, opting to show serial killer Paul Spector’s heinous acts without any sort of warning before them or light “relief” to follow. There are also no excuses made on the villain’s behalf. No, he’s not just some disturbed loner, as many fictionalized accounts of monsters like Spector would paint him: He’s a seemingly normal family man, who’s adored by his children and would be absolutely forgettable…if only viewers weren’t aware of what he did in his spare time. THE FALL doesn’t shy away from the idea that even the most seemingly innocuous men among us can, and will, be the most dangerous people imaginable.
And then there’s the unapologetic feminist bent, for which THE FALL has received a lot of praise. Stella Gibson is a walking, talking lexicon of feminist rhetoric. Rather than painting this as something special or drawing a lot of excessive attention to it — either negative or positive — the characterization just is. Gibson defies any stereotypes associated with the well-known “strong female character” and is, quite frankly, above all of that. She is who she is, and if you don’t like it? Too bad. She is, to badly quote Christopher Nolan’s THE DARK KNIGHT, the hero we deserve. I could continue to write a love letter to this character, but I basically already did as a guest contributor on Just About Write’s “Strong Women Series.” So, moving on.
Last but never least, there’s Gillian Anderson’s performance. This, too, falls into my general theme of “unapologetic,” as she’s unapologetically talented. Given some of the interviews I’ve seen and heard, she’d probably disagree. But too bad. I’m unapologetically in awe of just how fully she’s slipped into pretty much every character she’s ever played; and her portrayal of Stella Gibson is, by far, one of her best turns. So there.
Amy Imhoff: Honestly, I think the creep and suspense factors are very strong and make for highly compelling television. Too often, I have a general idea of where things are going; but with this show, that is not the case. I love not knowing! Dornan’s serial killer vibe is understated, which makes him way more scary — because he’s smart and deliberate. I also find the way Stella handles the men she’s surrounded with at work to be inspiring because she is just not taking their shit. I do wish at times she had a bit more levity; but that is just not Stella’s vibe, which I can totally respect. I think Gillian often plays these uber-serious people who are wound pretty tightly because she herself does not seem like an overly serious person; rather, she has a sense of humor and mischief about her. Both Spector and Stella are deadly serious, and I think both need to be. I am also quite fond of Danielle Ferrington; I quite like the actress that plays her, Niamh McGrady. Supporting cast is A+ all around. Oh, and Stella’s little ways of enticing Spector to be in contact, like wearing the nail polish on camera – that was just cool.
Erin Allen: Obviously, Gillian Anderson is the draw, but there are a lot of strong aspects that make THE FALL a great show. Besides being aesthetically appealing, the show touches on important, topical issues like feminism and misogyny. The cat-and-mouse cop drama is given new life with these characters and the interesting sub-plots. In other words, you come for Gillian and you end up staying for, well, Gillian, but a whole slew of other reasons, too.
I love the commentary this show makes on rape culture and sexism. I’ve read criticism that it sensationalizes violence against women, but you can’t really address the subject without portraying it. It sheds light on the conversations we should be having, especially in these times of Brock Turners and Donald Trumps. Stella smartly and poetically shoots down sexism when it’s directed at her or when sexist thinking gets in the way of her investigation. She breaks down the conventional thinking of how a woman is supposed to behave. For example, when she ends up sleeping with a married man, it is suggested to her that she should’ve thought to ask if he was married even though he wasn’t wearing a ring. The way she answers when she’s being questioned points out the major double standard. She approaches a man to fulfill a sexual desire and gets judgement. She expertly shuts this down: “Man fucks woman. Subject man, verb fucks, object woman. That’s okay. Woman fucks man. Woman subject, man object. That’s not so comfortable for you, is it?” Anderson said she was surprised that the scene where she met James Olson was shocking to people. We need to move towards a reality where that behavior isn’t shocking. A woman going after what she wants and a woman wanting sex should not be surprising nor should it be condemned.
Stella is careful of how she presents information from the investigation to the public, being mindful of how the media skews things: “Let’s not refer to them as innocent. The media likes to divide women into virgins and vamps. Angels and whores. Let’s not encourage them.” We’ve seen recently that this trend still exists and, in fact, still runs rampant in our culture. We clearly see men controlling and manipulating women through Spector’s violence, but the show also portrays many of the different ways this happens. Jimmy physically and emotionally abuses his wife. Burns drunkenly forces himself on Stella. Eastwood pointedly questions her on some of her decisions. There are also subtler ways this manipulation occurs, too, and I appreciate that the series addresses them. It’s important to Burns that Stella feels guilt. He is offended when she makes a comparison between Spector’s depravity and his behavior towards her in her hotel room. “It’s not the same, but you crossed a line.” Just because it isn’t as atrocious as Spector’s crimes doesn’t excuse the act.
During my last rewatch of THE FALL, I had a dream where someone broke into my home and attacked me. I screamed and screamed as loud as I could and my husband sleeping next to me (in the dream) never woke up despite the noise I made. This is so indicative of how raging misogyny attempts to silence women. It wasn’t so much that I was getting attacked; it was that I was not being heard that scared me. In a scene in season one, Spector is watching Stella on the news. He mutes the TV, literally taking her voice away. Taking our voice away makes it easier for men to view us as objects. THE FALL brings the importance of women’s voices to the forefront and examines society’s way of trying to silence them.
Laura Mastantuono: I should quote Erin. Definitely, the draw was Gillian Anderson. I started watching this show last year after hearing lots of praise about it, and I wasn’t disappointed. Truth to be told, even if curiosity about Gillian playing this role and how great Stella Gibson was made me press play for the pilot, I was completely surprised and astounded by the cinematography and how unapologetic (as Shana said) the writers were in presenting the theme and plot. Usually in this kind of procedural, viewers get to see the behind the scenes about the detective’s or hero’s life, but this series showcases the double life of Spector and makes an almost perfect portrait of a sociopath (with him and young Katie).
The fact that the show ties the dark aspects of the scripts with its color palette, choice of camera angles, and movements and sound, it almost seems obvious to be pointing it out, but it’s a perfect example to study in film school. And not every show does it. There’s nothing lazy about how this show is constructed; and adding the more than stellar performances by the cast, it makes it addictive.
And then there’s the feminist aspects that Shana described so well. Stella Gibson is the kind of character we wanted but didn’t get. She just is this character; and even if you might speculate about what has happened to her, you don’t actually know. And it’s wonderful. Why? Because in life, when you’re drawn to a person or look up to someone, you don’t always get the backstory — it is the way it is. And Stella rules.
Lissete Lanuza: Obviously, the answer to this question is Gillian Anderson. I started watching for Gillian, without any idea what the show was about. It could have been about her staring at a wall for forty minutes every episode, and I still would have given it a shot. It’s Gillian. After I started watching, however, I fell in love with the show – and it wasn’t just because of Gillian. (Even if, to this day, she remains my favorite thing.)
First of all, the show is a treaty on feminism. There are few characters on TV who just exist in the way Stella Gibson does. Like Shana said, she is who she is, and THE FALL doesn’t treat the fact that she’s basically a role model like it’s a big thing. THE FALL just allows Gillian to be this woman, to inhabit her, and that sends an even bigger message than if they’d been trying to point out at every step how great and different she is.
But that’s the thing about this show – they present their story and let us draw our own conclusions, not just about Stella, but about Paul, and about almost every character and storyline. There’s no explanation, because the show treats us like adults who can reach our own conclusion, and that makes it both refreshing and addictive.
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Five Things You Need to Know About NBC’s TIMELESS
This fall NBC delivers a time-travel series that comes courtesy of a couple of powerhouse executive producers: Eric Kripke of SUPERNATURAL and REVOLUTION fame, and Shawn Ryan, best known for creating THE SHIELD.
This all-star team-up is about to give birth to TIMELESS, an epic, character-driven, sci-fi drama that sends characters hurtling through different periods in history and focuses on them dealing with the consequences of their actions while in those various eras.
The show’s imminent arrival happens when there’s a plethora of time-travel options airing year-round including 12 MONKEYS, OUTLANDER, DOCTOR WHO, DC’S LEGENDS OF TOMORROW, THE FLASH, and the newbies headed to the small screen this fall, the CW’s FREQUENCY and ABC’s TIME AFTER TIME.
TIMELESS will have to go above and beyond in order to stand out from the crowd. It’s clear after conversing with Kripke at the recent Television Critics Association’s Summer Press Tour that he feels his thriller has what it takes.
When we caught up with him, he talked about the two time-travel shows that influenced the creation of TIMELESS, gushed about the new cast carrying out his and his co-EP’s master plan, and discussed the pressures of adhering to the rules of the time-travel game.
Two late great series influenced Kripke’s love of time travel. “QUANTUM LEAP is one I say often,” says Kripke. “Because it was fun and it was really based on characters that have a lot of heart. The one I don’t bring up very much is VOYAGERS!, which was Jon-Erik Hexum and Meeno Peluce.”
VOYAGERS! aired for one season on NBC and debuted in 1982. “I loved that show when I was a kid,” he continues. “What I loved about VOYAGERS! was that they traveled through a different time period pretty much every episode. And they had a drive to really try to get some history into the show. Like they would be on the Titanic and then they would meet Thomas Edison and that always struck me.”
Expect TIMELESS to have all of that and more. “To be able to do sort of a modern, sophisticated, edgier version of that show, it sort of brings me great pleasure,” he explains. “Like the not so secret secret of SUPERNATURAL is it’s basically DUKES OF HAZZARD or KNIGHT RIDER, just kind of updated for modern audiences. And so, in my own way, this is QUANTUM LEAP and VOYAGER updated for modern audiences.”
There are plenty of opportunities for Kripke-Universe alums to guest star. Kripke has gone on record saying he’d love his SUPERNATURAL family to guest star including Jensen Ackles, Jared Padalecki, Misha Collins and JIm Beaver.
Another guest star resource is his previous NBC series, REVOLUTION. “For sure I would get Tracy [Spiridakos] and Billy [Burke] and Liz [Mitchell} on the show as quickly as I could.”
As far as the EP is concerned, TIMELESS will be the gift that keeps on giving. “The one thing I love about TIMELESS is there’s all these great opportunities for these amazing guest stars, these characters in history you don’t really know and we’re really working hard to give them really fleshed out interesting stories and characters.”
Kripke feels he’s struck gold with his cast of regulars. The TIMELESS cast is chock full of familiar faces. There’s RECTIFY and SUITS star Abigail Spencer, 90210’s Matt Lanter, BETTER OFF TED’s Malcolm Barrett and ER’s Dr. Luka Kovac a.k.a. Goran Visnjic.
Kripke knows the SUPERNATURAL cast he assembled is something special. He thinks this is a lightning-strikes-twice situation. “I’m really happy with these actors. Abigail Spencer is off-the-hook good. Like mind-blowingly deep and complicated. Matt Lanter and Malcolm Barrett are killing it and they’re so fun together.”
He says the chemistry with the trio is already evident. “They all give such nuanced and complicated performances. I was just talking to Shawn Ryan the other day about it. We shot this thing…we took over the entire backlot and built an entire 1865 street, which is insane.”
“We have all these crane shots and horses and 150 costumed extras,” he continues. “He said what did you think of the dailies? And I said, they’re great. They’re visuals. But, honestly, my favorite takes of that day were the close-ups of the three actors communicating with each other. They’re so charming and they’re so interesting together. Thank God.”
This world will have rules when it comes to time travel. Time travel on TV can be a tricky, tricky thing. If the rules don’t make sense, viewers get vocal. So the pressure is real. “We spend an incredible amount of time making sure that we’ve got our rules straight and that our universe is consistent and we spend as much time not telling those rules to the audience,” explains Kripke.
The aim is to limit the headaches that erupt when dealing with all things timey-wimey. “We want this to be a fun show. For instance, I’ll watch STAR WARS and they don’t spend much time explaining the rules in STAR WARS. There’s an opening crawl and that’s it. But there’s an incredible internal consistency and you just feel that you’re in a coherent universe. That’s really our goal here which is we want the show to be simple and fun.”
One rule: the TIMELESS characters won’t be able to travel within their own timelines. This means they can’t directly go back and fix their own mistakes or wrong turns. “Garcia Flynn…we’re playing Goran as probably about 40 or so early 40s, so about mid-’70s is about as late as we can travel on the show. Certainly for now.”
If this rule ever changes, it won’t happen without a lot of thought and debate. “Believe me, what’s happening under the surface of that is an incredible amount of discussion and conversation to make sure that we’re making a credible and valid world for the audience to get lost in.”
SUPERNATURAL fans will be rewarded for tuning into TIMELESS. According to Kripke, his new series will feature some Easter eggs that will appeal to the SPN Family including the use of fun aliases and, once again, utilizing January 24 as the birthdate of one of the characters. “There are actually a few SUPERNATURAL references all over the pilot. It’s like this little game I play with the fans.”
He also says to expect similarities that are more big picture in nature. “One of the biggest things I think SUPERNATURAL fans will respond to is, in many ways, the thematic is similar. Ultimately, TIMELESS is a show about whether there is fate or free will.”
“If you could go back and change history, should you? Or is there a flow to the way history is supposed to go. And so what universe do we live in? Do we live in an ordered one? Or do we live in a random and chaotic one where you could go back and change history and what difference does it make? So that’s an argument that the characters in our show have.”
“To me, the fun of making a time travel show is, yes, you get to travel to these amazing periods in history and you get to meet these amazing characters but you also get to have deeper, make deeper, philosophical points,” he goes on to explain. “And that’s certainly something that I loved to do in SUPERNATURAL and we’re certainly doing that in TIMELESS.”
TIMELESS takes off Monday, October 3 at 10/9c on NBC (U.S.) and Global (Canada).
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